CHALLENGE P86

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The Norton Challenge P86 – The Bike That Could Have Saved The British Motorcycle Industry

The Norton Challenge P86 was a machine developed by two of Britain's most famous motoring companies to save the British motorcycle industry and revive Norton
silodrome.com silodrome.com
 
Unfortunately history tells us the inline four was embraced for over 50 years.

Norton could have made a more practical twin with a 270° crankshaft that might have appealed to the masses in the real world (which payed the bills)
The P86 was never going to be a realistic road bike or viable platform even as a loose base foundation. (The P86 engine weight was getting close (40 lbs) to that of the CBX/6 @ 234 lbs iirc. I know it was heavy to carry from the bench back in the day)

Even Ducati had to pull the plug on the expensive and time consuming to build bevel drive engines by 1986, change with the times or fade away.
 
And I guess the paragraph about the ‘groundbreaking‘ idea to use the engine as a fully stressed member was just put in there to bait Vincent fans...!
 
I think we've covered this before but the engine, much improved and producing a claimed 110+bhp at 10,500 rpm, featured in the Quantel Cosworth which raced at Daytona Battle of the Twins in the 1980s. Won in 1988 with Roger Marshall on board.

See further info here:
http://paralleltwins.e-monsite.com/...istiques-techniques/the-quanell-cosworth.html
https://riderfiles.wordpress.com/2011/11/20/the-quantel-cosworth/
https://www.cyclenews.com/2018/05/article/archives-when-cosworth-won-at-daytona/

It was the usual lack of investment in the British bike industry that killed it off. Norton tried to race it in an under-developed state. Why the much missed Peter Williams was sidelined in its development is a complete mystery. See his book Designed to Race for further details. Andover Norton have copies available.

Another sad 'what if'.

Andy
 
There's one in the National Motorcycle Museum, albeit a rebuild by Norman White after the "Fire".
 

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DevonNorton said:
I think we've covered this before but the engine, much improved and producing a claimed 110+bhp at 10,500 rpm, featured in the Quantel Cosworth which raced at Daytona Battle of the Twins in the 1980s. Won in 1988 with Roger Marshall on board.

See further info here:
http://paralleltwins.e-monsite.com/...istiques-techniques/the-quanell-cosworth.html
https://riderfiles.wordpress.com/2011/11/20/the-quantel-cosworth/
https://www.cyclenews.com/2018/05/article/archives-when-cosworth-won-at-daytona/

It was the usual lack of investment in the British bike industry that killed it off. Norton tried to race it in an under-developed state. Why the much missed Peter Williams was sidelined in its development is a complete mystery. See his book Designed to Race for further details. Andover Norton have copies available.

Another sad 'what if'.

Andy
Click to expand...
Peter Williams said the Challenge was a product disaster, if he was to be involved I guess he would have required a complete new engine as the Cosworth was a piece of junk for racing purposes, I suppose his views on the engine would exclude him from a development team.
 
storm42 said:
Peter Williams said the Challenge was a product disaster, if he was to be involved I guess he would have required a complete new engine as the Cosworth was a piece of junk for racing purposes, I suppose his views on the engine would exclude him from a development team.
Click to expand...
What I meant was why was Peter Williams not involved earlier working with Cosworth to prevent it being such a 'disaster'. He had proved himself with the 1973 monocoque JPN racer and earlier work on the 1972 JPN racer. I guess some of this is down to timing but I also sense from Peter's book that there was a technical hierarchy operating which was less than inclusive. How different from the approach taken by Doug Hele when he was at Triumph, who is quoted as saying, "There are no bosses in a technical discussion".
From the later Quantel work it turns out that the engine wasn't so bad, but after much further development.
Just my view.
Andy
 
Sadly, Peter Wiliams will no longer be able to shed further light on this topic.

'Cest La Vie...
 
Rob Graves put £100000 into the engine and punched it out to 823cc and took advantage of 10 years of chassis development to win a race, and in the mid 80's that was a lot of money.

Peter is without doubt a sad loss but fortunately he was interviewed a lot.

CHALLENGE P86
 
I would say though, it was of its time in a way, I remember seeing it run at Donington and was full of hope for Norton.

20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing when you want to slag something off.
 
Any engine can be made to go if you put enough dosh and time into it!

As Ralph said, £100k is an unimaginable amount in the 1980s. It would have bought you TEN houses near where I lived !
 
Yes Nigel and with the might of United Engineering Industries behind the project.

Another article on the bike, isn't the internet brilliant?

www.odd-bike.com

Norton P86 750 Challenge - Norton's Last Gasp

The Norton-Cosworth P86 prototype, a last gasp effort by a dying Norton to remain competitive on the track and the street.
www.odd-bike.com www.odd-bike.com
 
Look up on this forum; Quantal Cosworth Norton first posted by swooshdave Dec 14th 2013.
The Cosworth was never going to be a success in the F750 series, because that was dominated by the Yamaha TZ 750 and all its variations. . . . . . . . .
 
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